AMD's cancelled RDNA 4 GPU could have doubled the 7900 XTX's performance

Daniel Sims

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Rumor mill: It has long been suspected that the Radeon RX 8000 series – AMD's next generation of graphics cards – will focus exclusively on affordable mid-range products. However, this wasn't always the plan. Newly unveiled code suggests that AMD canceled a flagship RDNA 4 model that might have directly competed with upcoming high-end offerings from Intel and Nvidia.

Data-mined code that recently emerged on the Anandtech forums indicates that AMD was working on an RDNA 4 GPU at one point, doubling most of the RX 7900 XTX's system specs. Team Red hasn't confirmed anything regarding its upcoming graphics cards, but rumors suggest the company canceled the new flagship to focus on mainstream GPUs.

User Kepler_L2 posted code suggesting that the chip codenamed "N4C," likely to become the Radeon RX 8900 XTX, would have featured nine shader engines, compared to the six found in AMD's current flagship, the 7900 XTX. Furthermore, the top-end RDNA 4 card might have at least doubled the 7900 XTX's chiplet count from seven to between 13 and 20. Another user claimed that the number of compute units would have increased from 96 to 200.

Given the specs, the card could have outperformed the current PC graphics king, Nvidia's GeForce RTX 4090. Speaking of, Team Green is expected to unveil a successor before the end of this year with roughly a 70 percent performance uplift. Moreover, Intel plans to launch its first enthusiast-class GPU as part of its sophomore Battlemage lineup this year.

AMD reportedly shelved its high-end RDNA 4 plans to conserve limited silicon for increasingly profitable AI chips, so a three-way battle between flagship cards must wait until future generations.

Prior rumors regarding AMD, which should be taken with a grain of salt, suggest that the Radeon RX 8000 series will debut this year with two mid-range products based on the Navi 48 and Navi 44 GPUs. Navi 48 might roughly equal the performance of an RX 7900 XT or RTX 4080 for hundreds of dollars less. Meanwhile, the lower-end Navi 44 is projected to match the RTX 4060 Ti for less than $300 and possibly as little as $199.

However, the RDNA 4 cards might make compromises in certain areas. They may only slightly improve upon RDNA 3's ray tracing performance – an area in which AMD already lags behind Nvidia – and Kepler previously reported that the VRAM for both GPUs will stick to GDDR6 and only reach 18Gbps. Nvidia's upcoming products will likely upgrade to faster GDDR7.

AMD is expected to return to the high-end battleground with RDNA 5 next year, which will mark a transition to fully chiplet-based GPUs.

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Probably the MCM design still didn't work as it should. As the ultra high design costs of a high-end monolithic chip would not pay for themselves with sales, AMD swept it under the carpet to focus on the popular segment.
 
Because the commercial market is more profitable than consumer gaming cards and nVidia will outsell them in that market, anyway. They stay competitive in the mid-ranged market, make everyone who isn't a twitch streamer happy with good price-performance while raking in the money in the commercial market. They've only contracted with TSMC for so much capacity, they have to manage it appropriately. Regardless of what people say, everything but the 4060 and 4090 sat on shelves. Despite what nVidia might want you to believe, they didn't sell that many 4090s to gamers and stopped shipping new dies to vendors back in November.

And don't get me wrong, the 4090 is a beast, but the $1500+ market just isn't that big. The $1000+ market isn't that big which is why 4080s sat on shelves. The only card that did fairly well in the 40 series was the 4070 and that was because that was basically the most consumers were willing to pay for a "high end" card. Worst part about the 4070 is that it was more realisticly suppose to be a 4060ti.
 
Regardless of what people say, everything but the 4060 and 4090 sat on shelves. Despite what nVidia might want you to believe, they didn't sell that many 4090s to gamers and stopped shipping new dies to vendors back in November.
What are you saying? Are you saying that the mid-range is more important than the ultra-high end segment of the market?
 
The AI excuse is only a tiny part of the reason. AMD engineer said the MCM design for RDNA4 was proving a headache to get wotking properly as it was far more complex than RDNA 3 MCM. AMD could have gotten it to work but not in the time frame they wanted and it would have meant pushing RDNA 5 further back and taken a lot of money and manhours. The RDNA5 team is a separate one to the RDNA 4 team, and they were having much less trouble and obviously have and extra 18 months to get the design right.

If rumours about RDNA 4 N48 are true and we get between 7900XT and 7900XTX in raster along with decent upgrades in RT and hopefully performance per watt, even at $500 (assuming it's 16GB/256 bit) they will sell like hotcakes. Ngreedia on the other hand will have 5090 and 5080 to sell in tiny numbers at $2K+ and $1.2K+ and 5070 and lower won't be out for another 6 months from 5090 release.
 
To give free advertisements to Nvidia when showing off their 7800X3D. Reviews are left with using the 4090 to show maximum gains. Rinse repeat Blackwell 5090/Zen5 3d. By allowing Nvidia to swell prices with Blackwell AMD can fill in the gaps accordingly conveniently with rdna5.
 
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Guess AMD is not ready or not willing to take over Nvidia, even in the next gen graphics card race. Looks like AMD lost the will to compete, nowadays.

(P.S. I'm still hanging on to its wonderful 5700XT card, despite already upgraded to another on my main machine.)
 
What are you saying? Are you saying that the mid-range is more important than the ultra-high end segment of the market?
In terms of absolute sales? Yeah, it is. Cards like the 1060 and 1070 made up the majority of pascal sales, not the 1080ti.

That being said a series of cards with no flagship dont do that well sales wise, see also the RX 5000 and polaris series.
Probably a mix of AMD prioritizing higher margin AI chips over gaming chips, having limited capacity at TSMC, and if rumors are to be believed AMD has utterly failed at keeping up with nvidia in RT. Assuming blackwell improves like ampere did that would put this supposed flagship at mid tier nvidia at best with any sort of RT.

Guess AMD is not ready or not willing to take over Nvidia, even in the next gen graphics card race. Looks like AMD lost the will to compete, nowadays.

(P.S. I'm still hanging on to its wonderful 5700XT card, despite already upgraded to another on my main machine.)
The ultimate irony is that the internet lost their collective minds about how nvidia was going to leave them high and dry to focus on the AI dream.....and it ended up being AMD who did it.

IMO this will hurt AMD in the long run. Consistency is important for consumers. I have a 6800xt, it works great. If I was looking to push either 4k or newer games with more RT, I'd be looking at an upgrade in the next year or two, which would only leave nvidia as a viable option. I dont want that.

Nvidia has such good hgih end sales in no small part because they keep an upgrade schedule. It seems many keep their GPU for 2 gens, then upgrade at the 3rd gen with the newest flagship (or whatever class they are in). The 3060 seemed to do a huge number on remaining maxwell owners and the 4070 seems to have unseated the remaining pascal hangouts.

AMD does not have this. Thus, when they do get a good flagship, it doesnt sell as well, because nvidia was handed that market on a silver platter back in 2016.

I do wonder if Intel will throw a monkey wrench into this plan. If Battlemage also hits upper midrange performance with better RT then AMD, then AMD may be in serious trouble.
The AI excuse is only a tiny part of the reason. AMD engineer said the MCM design for RDNA4 was proving a headache to get wotking properly as it was far more complex than RDNA 3 MCM. AMD could have gotten it to work but not in the time frame they wanted and it would have meant pushing RDNA 5 further back and taken a lot of money and manhours. The RDNA5 team is a separate one to the RDNA 4 team, and they were having much less trouble and obviously have and extra 18 months to get the design right.

If rumours about RDNA 4 N48 are true and we get between 7900XT and 7900XTX in raster along with decent upgrades in RT and hopefully performance per watt, even at $500 (assuming it's 16GB/256 bit) they will sell like hotcakes. Ngreedia on the other hand will have 5090 and 5080 to sell in tiny numbers at $2K+ and $1.2K+ and 5070 and lower won't be out for another 6 months from 5090 release.
"tiny numbers", guarantee that the 5090 and 5080 individually will outsell the entirety of rDNA4.
 
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The 8900 XTX could've created another hole in my pocket, twice as large this time. Yeah, for over $2000.... right?
 
I am not sure if it is feasible to double the specs without drastically increasing power consumption. Assuming AMD sticks with TSMC 4nm/5nm, the die is going to be huge. And that expected increase in performance for Nvidia’s next gen GPU, I will take that with a bucket of salt. Number looks too good to be true, unless they resort to some new proprietary software that is exclusive to Blackwell.
 
"AMD's next generation of graphics cards – will focus exclusively on affordable mid-range products."
RIP, AMD! Few people are going to buy cards that are rebranded 3-4 year old tech, but cheaper. Oh, they`re going to have more power efficient chips that do exactly the same thing, ok, who cares? Also, a company that cannot compete in high end automatically stinks to consumers, even though their products could be good. Come on, Intel! But that`s a long shot, really. We know Intel is light years away, so, be ready for more years of Nvidia`s small increments for outraging prices.
 
"AMD's next generation of graphics cards – will focus exclusively on affordable mid-range products."
RIP, AMD! Few people are going to buy cards that are rebranded 3-4 year old tech, but cheaper. Oh, they`re going to have more power efficient chips that do exactly the same thing, ok, who cares? Also, a company that cannot compete in high end automatically stinks to consumers, even though their products could be good. Come on, Intel! But that`s a long shot, really. We know Intel is light years away, so, be ready for more years of Nvidia`s small increments for outraging prices.

90% of people buy GPUs under $500. It's by no means a rebrand, if it offers better price/performance it will sell well, that's all that matters in this segment.
 
"AMD's next generation of graphics cards – will focus exclusively on affordable mid-range products."
RIP, AMD! Few people are going to buy cards that are rebranded 3-4 year old tech, but cheaper. Oh, they`re going to have more power efficient chips that do exactly the same thing, ok, who cares? Also, a company that cannot compete in high end automatically stinks to consumers, even though their products could be good. Come on, Intel! But that`s a long shot, really. We know Intel is light years away, so, be ready for more years of Nvidia`s small increments for outraging prices.
Yeah for some reason AMD is fortifying its position in the midrange at $499 with rdna 4 and ps5pro rumored. Probably to compete directly with Intel. The silver lining is the hope that Intel brings. Especially with their current software is improving at a faster rate than AMD's lately with superior Xess quality to FSR and significant driver performance with ark. Most agree the gpu market definitely needs Intel Battmage to be competetive. It's AMD market share to lose.
We all want a third player on the map but not at the well coordinated duopolly that doesn't compete in pricing/ performance; attempting to swell prices and space itself from Intel as far as possible in the process.
 
90% of people buy GPUs under $500. It's by no means a rebrand, if it offers better price/performance it will sell well, that's all that matters in this segment.
Yeah this is the fat of the market. Especially in current market conditions and economy. The whales willing to pay exubrient prices over $1000 on a graphics card as shrinking every day even compared to just a year or 2 ago. Nvidia could attempt to swell prices as high as the sky with fat margins at the cost of revenue. Will gamers buy a high end shiny new graphics card when they can't afford their next meal or pay rent 🤔. I agree the $499 is for targeting high revenue. I wonder what would happen if Intel's Battlemage end up being superior in ray tracing to rdna 4 .
 

Is it a situation for AMD that between poking the bear (nVidia) with a high-end part (like this) and opening up whole other level of high-end parts (they step up their game some) from nVidia (its not worth it), and, or AMD can use these high-end parts other places where makes better revenues and profits ?
 
90% of people buy GPUs under $500. It's by no means a rebrand, if it offers better price/performance it will sell well, that's all that matters in this segment.
Devil's advocate. Polaris was in a similar situation. It offered performance that matched the old 290x flagship in performance for a cheap $200 price. While they did sell, Nvidia' 1060, 1070, and 1080 ALL outsold the entirety of polaris individually.

It wasn't a "rebrand", but it also wasnt moving the needle forward. The halo effect is real. Even if there is no flagship, stopping at the same performance they already had isnt going to interest as many people.
 
Despite all the sound speculation in this thread, I don't think we really know why AMD is behaving in this manner.

Maybe, just maybe, we will find out someday.
 
If AMD comes out with a card priced at $499 that gives 7900 XTX performance next gen with at least 16GB VRAM and power draw around 250W - I'd drop my 3080Ti in a heartbeat and pick one up. But if it's priced over that $499 mark, I don't think I'd bother with it. If AMD isn't swinging for the fences for top-end cards, they need to have something that's solid and priced right for the mid-tier range. Hopefully they don't screw it up.

I don't give a rip about DLSS, RT, FG, FSR, XeSS and anything else I missed that these companies are putting out to improve framerates or what have you with software tricks. They all suck.
 
90% of people buy GPUs under $500. It's by no means a rebrand, if it offers better price/performance it will sell well, that's all that matters in this segment.

Exactly. As a recreational, hobbyist gamer (probably not alone), I just want the best experience, which right now is smooth 4K. I also have a family, mortgage, bills, savings, life... Coming from the GTX 1070, the 6800XT blew me away for $400 (Nov 2022), and if I were buying now I'd probably look for a deal on a 7900XT. I, for one, am psyched about a $500 8800XT(?) that outperforms the 7900XT under 300W.

I'm never paying $1600 for a 4090/5090, or even $1000 for a 4080.
 
90% of people buy GPUs under $500. It's by no means a rebrand, if it offers better price/performance it will sell well, that's all that matters in this segment.
Yes, most people buy mid range, but not two, three, four years ago mid range. I own a 6700XT. that`s a card released in 2021. Then they released a 6750XT and now a 7700XT, the latter giving me a "whooping" 5 to 12 fps increase if I were to buy it. RT in the dumpster as usual. Not that it matters for a mid range card, but you always want more stuff for your money. Next, they will release a 8700XT that will add nothing, but it will cost... what, 300$? Ok, why should I buy that? For lower electricity bill? Is this AMD`s marketing now? And keep dreaming you`ll get 7900XT performance for less than 500$. It`s 750$ now. They`ll shave off 100 tops for a 8900XT and still be in the loss, considering they started selling at 900. That will make it 650$.
 
"AMD's next generation of graphics cards – will focus exclusively on affordable mid-range products."
RIP, AMD! Few people are going to buy cards that are rebranded 3-4 year old tech, but cheaper. Oh, they`re going to have more power efficient chips that do exactly the same thing, ok, who cares? Also, a company that cannot compete in high end automatically stinks to consumers, even though their products could be good. Come on, Intel! But that`s a long shot, really. We know Intel is light years away, so, be ready for more years of Nvidia`s small increments for outraging prices.
Typical fanboyism...

If AMD provide an XTX for 500$, then Nvidia will need to figure out something to justify the price of a 5070 at 650$, which will be on par with a 4080 at best.
 
If AMD canceled their top GPU, it would be because of CoWoS allocation at TSMC. They are going to make 4B$, at least, on MI300 accelerator alone.
 
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